Overnight guest with standing to challenge entry of house did not have standing to challenge entry into the backyard curtilage; knock-and-talk led to surrounding house and [police created] exigency
The E.D. Wis. holds that an overnight guest who otherwise had standing to challenge the search of the house [Olsen] did not have standing to challenge the entry of officers into the curtilage of the backyard during a knock-and-talk. [This was an extraordinary knock-and-talk:] The officers came to the house from all directions and surrounded it while investigating a heroin operation based on an informant seeing heroin on the premises in the extremely recent past. Somebody inside threw a bag of heroin out the window on the knock. That act created exigent circumstances for a warrantless entry based on reasonable suspicion of destruction of evidence. [The court fails to note police created exigency.] United States v. Butler, 2007 U.S. Dist. LEXIS 55907 (E.D. Wis. August 1, 2007):
Butler criticizes the recommendation and argues that the police were unreasonable in their “knock and talk” tactics because (1) they impermissibly and illegitimately entered the back area of the residence when they had no authority to do so, in order to detain persons found in the residence; and (2) they manufactured exigent circumstances and made a warrantless and illegitimate entry into the home. (Butler’s Obj. 5-7.) Over Butler’s objections, the court notes that the “knock and talk” form of investigation was reasonable, and the officers did not gain impermissible or illegitimate entry into the home as Butler suggests.
To begin, this circuit has noted that “knock and talks” are reasonable forms of police investigation, subject to certain constitutional limitations. Adeyeye, 359 at 461 (7th Cir. 2004) (approving of the “knock and talk” technique of investigation). The relevant preliminary Fourth Amendment inquiry for a “knock and talk” is whether a “reasonable person would feel free to terminate the encounter.” Id. at 462. Turning to the instant case, the court finds that it’s unlikely that the defendants would have felt free to terminate the encounter. The stipulated facts demonstrate that the officers came to the residence, surrounded the home, knocked on the doors, displayed their badges, and demanded that the occupants open the doors. (Stipulated Facts PP 3-4.) The officers’ actions, particularly the demand that the occupants open the door, lead the court to conclude that a reasonable person would, more than likely, not feel at liberty to terminate the encounter or request that the officers leave. Thus, the court finds that the conduct of the officers in this case “conveyed the message that compliance with their requests was required,” and therefore “transformed the situation from a consensual encounter into an investigatory stop.” See Adeyeye, 359 F.3d at 462 (citing United States v. Jerez, 108 F.3d 684 (7th Cir.1997)).
However, the constitutional inquiry does not end there; upon a determination that the individuals did not feel free to terminate the encounter, the court must next consider whether the officers had reasonable suspicion to conduct the “investigatory stop” or “knock and talk.” See Adeyeye, 359 F.3d at 462. “Reasonable suspicion” is “more than an inchoate and unparticularized suspicion or hunch,” and determining whether or not reasonable suspicion existed involves examining the totality of the circumstances. United States v. Sokolow, 490 U.S. 1, 7 (1989) (quoting Terry v. Ohio, 392 U.S. 1, 27 (1968)). The court once again turns to the stipulated facts and readily determines that there was reasonable suspicion for the officers to perform the “knock and talk” investigation. The facts state that the officers were investigating a tip, given that same day, that the persons in control of that residence were operating a heroin house. The informant gave facts that he or she personally observed large quantities of heroin within the home. (Stipulated Facts P 1.) These facts, viewed in totality, form an adequate finding of reasonable suspicion, and the court finds that the officers did not violate the Fourth Amendment in conducting the “knock and talk.”
Comment: Surrounding a house during a knock-and-talk is extraordinary and per se coercive, and the court correctly concludes that the persons inside would feel compelled to comply with any request for entry. The court fails, however, to decide that the act of the officers was a police-created exigency when the occupants threw the bag out the window in response. As for the destruction of evidence, how much heroin was in the sandwich bag tossed out the window compared to the whole amount allegedly inside, and did they have time to move that amount? What was the surveillance before the knock-and-talk? This case is just wrong to me, and it should be appealed and reversed.
Defense counsel was not ineffective for failing to move to suppress on the ground that the defendant’s stop was pretextual under Ladson. There was an objective basis for the stop, which was challenged, and the case was sufficiently like other cases finding no pretext that the court finds none. State v. Nichols, 161 Wn.2d 1, 162 P.3d 1122 (2007). Comment: This case summarizes Washington’s law on pretexual stops and searches, but finds the facts deficient.
Defendant had been held more than 48 hours before arraignment in apparent violation of Gerstein and County of Riverside but he had a full and fair opportunity to challenge that in state court and did and lost, so a federal court could not review it on habeas. Evans v. Booker, 2007 U.S. Dist. LEXIS 55735 (E.D. Mich. August 1, 2007).*
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"If it was easy, everybody would be doing it. It isn't, and they don't." —Me
"Life is not a matter of holding good cards, but of playing a poor hand well." –Josh Billings (pseudonym of Henry Wheeler Shaw), Josh Billings on Ice, and Other Things (1868) (erroneously attributed to Robert Louis Stevenson, among others)
“I am still learning.” —Domenico Giuntalodi (but misattributed to Michelangelo Buonarroti (common phrase throughout 1500's)).
"Love work; hate mastery over others; and avoid intimacy with the government."
—Shemaya, in the Thalmud
"It is a pleasant world we live in, sir, a very pleasant world. There are bad people in it, Mr. Richard, but if there were no bad people, there would be no good lawyers."
—Charles Dickens, “The Old Curiosity Shop ... With a Frontispiece. From a Painting by Geo. Cattermole, Etc.” 255 (1848)
"A system of law that not only makes certain conduct criminal, but also lays down rules for the conduct of the authorities, often becomes complex in its application to individual cases, and will from time to time produce imperfect results, especially if one's attention is confined to the particular case at bar. Some criminals do go free because of the necessity of keeping government and its servants in their place. That is one of the costs of having and enforcing a Bill of Rights. This country is built on the assumption that the cost is worth paying, and that in the long run we are all both freer and safer if the Constitution is strictly enforced." —Williams v. Nix, 700 F. 2d 1164, 1173 (8th Cir. 1983) (Richard Sheppard Arnold, J.), rev'd Nix v. Williams, 467 US. 431 (1984).
"The criminal goes free, if he must, but it is the law that sets him free. Nothing can destroy a government more quickly than its failure to observe its own laws, or worse, its disregard of the charter of its own existence." —Mapp v. Ohio, 367 U.S. 643, 659 (1961).
"Any costs the exclusionary rule are costs imposed directly by the Fourth Amendment."
—Yale Kamisar, 86 Mich.L.Rev. 1, 36 n. 151 (1987).
"There have been powerful hydraulic pressures throughout our history that bear heavily on the Court to water down constitutional guarantees and give the police the upper hand. That hydraulic pressure has probably never been greater than it is today." — Terry v. Ohio, 392 U.S. 1, 39 (1968) (Douglas, J., dissenting).
"The great end, for which men entered into society, was to secure their property." —Entick v. Carrington, 19 How.St.Tr. 1029, 1066, 95 Eng. Rep. 807 (C.P. 1765)
"It is a fair summary of history to say that the safeguards of liberty have frequently been forged in controversies involving not very nice people. And so, while we are concerned here with a shabby defrauder, we must deal with his case in the context of what are really the great themes expressed by the Fourth Amendment." —United States v. Rabinowitz, 339 U.S. 56, 69 (1950) (Frankfurter, J., dissenting)
"The course of true law pertaining to searches and seizures, as enunciated here, has not–to put it mildly–run smooth." —Chapman v. United States, 365 U.S. 610, 618 (1961) (Frankfurter, J., concurring).
"A search is a search, even if it happens to disclose nothing but the bottom of a turntable." —Arizona v. Hicks, 480 U.S. 321, 325 (1987)
"For the Fourth Amendment protects people, not places. What a person knowingly exposes to the public, even in his own home or office, is not a subject of Fourth Amendment protection. ... But what he seeks to preserve as private, even in an area accessible to the public, may be constitutionally protected." —Katz v. United States, 389 U.S. 347, 351 (1967)
“Experience should teach us to be most on guard to protect liberty when the Government’s purposes are beneficent. Men born to freedom are naturally alert to repel invasion of their liberty by evil-minded rulers. The greatest dangers to liberty lurk in insidious encroachment by men of zeal, well-meaning but without understanding.” —United States v. Olmstead, 277 U.S. 438, 479 (1925) (Brandeis, J., dissenting)
“Liberty—the freedom from unwarranted intrusion by government—is as easily lost through insistent nibbles by government officials who seek to do their jobs too well as by those whose purpose it is to oppress; the piranha can be as deadly as the shark.” —United States v. $124,570, 873 F.2d 1240, 1246 (9th Cir. 1989)
"You can't always get what you want / But if you try sometimes / You just might find / You get what you need." —Mick Jagger & Keith Richards, Let it Bleed (album, 1969)
"In Germany, they first came for the communists, and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a communist. Then they came for the Jews, and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Jew. Then they came for the trade unionists, and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a trade unionist. Then they came for the Catholics and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Catholic. Then they came for me–and by that time there was nobody left to speak up."
—Martin Niemöller (1945) [he served seven years in a concentration camp]
“Children grow up thinking the adult world is ordered, rational, fit for purpose. It’s crap. Becoming a man is realising that it’s all rotten. Realising how to celebrate that rottenness, that’s freedom.” – John le Carré, The Night Manager (1993), line by Richard Roper
"The point of the Fourth Amendment, which often is not grasped by zealous officers, is not that it denies law enforcement the support of the usual inferences which reasonable men draw from evidence. Its protection consists in requiring that those inferences be drawn by a neutral and detached magistrate instead of being judged by the officer engaged in the often competitive enterprise of ferreting out crime." —Johnson v. United States, 333 U.S. 10, 13-14 (1948)
The book was dedicated in the first (1982) and sixth (2025) editions to Justin William Hall (1975-2025). He was three when this project started in 1978.